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Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem
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ablebodiedman
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Post: #31
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Interpretum,

You asked the question about divine intervention in the Fall of Jerusalem.

Yep, I think there was divine intervention.

Do I think the four winds have recently been released implying divine intervention on the world right now?

Yep, I think we are experiencing divine intervention.

It is clear enough to me.

How does that derail your post?


In Christ

abe


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Interpretum
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Post: #32
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Hi Totaldismay

Totaldismay Wrote:
Since the thread is Divine intervention with jerusalems fall.


Thanks for staying on-topic!

Quote:
I wonder if the women and children in the city were spared?


I doubt they were. In fact, Josephus recalls an example of a woman EATING her own child... and Jesus also implied such things, when he said woe to the pregnant woman and those suckling child.

However, let us not forget that Jehovah made AMPLE provision for people to escape. For some 32 years, between 33 and 66AD, he had preachers going around Jerusalem and Israel sharing Jesus' message, which would have included the imminent doom of Jerusalem, and what to do about it.

This is why Jesus placed emphasis on the URGENCY of heeding his words... like the days of Noah, and the days of Lot... the key thing was to flee at the right time.

Quote:
Apparently the people in the city of jeruselem did not care to follow the Lord and they received what was coming to them. Even the children it would seem the sins of the fathers did indeed fall on the heads of their sons.

I beleive the bible calls that generation evil and wicked in the same sentence.


Absolutely. To some extent, the sins of their fathers met up with them, as all the blood shed from Abel to Zechariah was to be charged upon that generation.

Nevertheless, Jesus described them as "a wicked and adulterous generation", presumably for a reason.

In fact, to me it an amazing example of Jehovah's mercy and forebearance that He put up with them for so long. Remember, he gave them SEVENTY WEEKS OF YEARS, i.e. 490 years! (Daniel 9)

Interesting that is 70 x 7. Jesus told us to forgive up to 77 times. I guess the limit of God's forgiveness ran out for them.


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03-14-2011 04:08 PM
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Totaldismay
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Post: #33
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

thanks for the clarity, my memory is not what it used to be. lol

"a wicked and adulterous generation",

yes it is interesting that 70 x 7 is 490
But please forgive me to point out that it does not a 77 make.

GOD didn't make it the seven more weeks of years to make 77 times here if you are trying to make a bridge.

sorry to be a pain

edited
So to my Point GOD does indeed allow Children to suffer, just as he does the animals who have done absolutely nothing wrong, just as he did his own Son who did nothing wrong.

Children were born into sin just the same, that is why the scripts admonish us to train a boy in the way from his youth.


So that brings the question as to "why" some and not others"
some jews made it out and were given warnings

Others did not.

if the generation was condemnd why were some favored?
why do some children die in this world while others do not?
why do some seemingly get special treatment? why did GOD pick one nation to be his at all? why not try with mulitple peoples.

03-14-2011 04:19 PM
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Post: #34
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Hi Abe

ablebodiedman Wrote:
How does that derail your post?


OK, in that sense it doesn't.

Quote:
Do I think the four winds have recently been released implying divine intervention on the world right now?

Yep, I think we are experiencing divine intervention.


OK, so let me ask you...

(1) Why does God seem to judge more harshly, those nations (i.e. Japan) that are closer to techtonic fault lines?

(2) How do we tell when a disaster is natural, and when it's an activity from the "four winds"?

(3) Are all disasters throughout history an act of God, or just these latest ones?


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03-14-2011 04:23 PM
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Mavos
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Post: #35
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Perhaps the destruction of Jerusalem itself was a divine intervention.


"I remember two things: That I am a great sinner, and that Christ is a great Saviour." - John Newton
03-14-2011 04:27 PM
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Post: #36
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Hi TD

Totaldismay Wrote:
yes it is interesting that 70 x 7 is 490
But please forgive me to point out that it does not a 77 make.

GOD didn't make it the seven more weeks of years to make 77 times here if you are trying to make a bridge.

sorry to be a pain


You're right, they're not the same things. However, the Interlinear says Jesus said "until / seventy times / seven".

I just find it interesting that SEVENTY WEEKS OF YEARS is also seventy times seven.

The only difference is we assume Jesus meant "seventy times" AND "seven".

But could it be that he was actually ALLUDING to Daniel's 70 x 7 prophecy?

I really don't know, but I'm pretty sure he would be been AWARE of that prophecy, since he later quoted from it in Matthew 24:15.

Anyway, it's just a thought... nothing hinges on it!

Quote:
So to my Point GOD does indeed allow Children to suffer, just as he does the animals who have done absolutely nothing wrong, just as he did his own Son who did nothing wrong.

Children were born into sin just the same, that is why the scripts admonish us to train a boy in the way from his youth.


I agree. The children might be innocent parties, but they do sometimes get caught up in things.


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03-14-2011 04:32 PM
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Post: #37
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Mavos Wrote:
Perhaps the destruction of Jerusalem itself was a divine intervention.


LOL... ah yes, I missed out the obvious one! :)


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03-14-2011 04:32 PM
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Post: #38
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Hi TD

Totaldismay Wrote:
So that brings the question as to "why" some and not others"
some jews made it out and were given warnings

Others did not.

if the generation was condemnd why were some favored?
why do some children die in this world while others do not?
why do some seemingly get special treatment? why did GOD pick one nation to be his at all? why not try with mulitple peoples.


Great question. I personally think that, by 66AD, ALL adult Jews would have heard enough about Jesus or about the events surrounding his life and death, or about all of the controversies, that they were able to make an intelligent enough decision about leaving, or staying... at that fateful time when the Romans came and then withdrew unexpectedly.

Plus, they had the prophecies of Daniel... particularly chapters 9 and 11, to show them where they were in the stream of time, i.e. after Messiah is "cut off", their city and holy place are destroyed. That would keep you on your toes if you believed Jesus was the Messiah!... and Jesus said it would occur within a generation.

As to why some were favoured, the only ones who were favored were those who accepted Jesus. Christ became LITERALLY the focal point, and the demarcation between salvation, and destruction... at least, for the Jews.

This is exactly as foretold by Malachi:

"And you people will again certainly see [the distinction] between a righteous one and a wicked one, between one serving God and one who has not served him.” (3:18)

This occurred starting in 33AD, when the Lord began to create a special people, known as Christians.

In my opinion, God only chooses a couple of people for truly "special treatment". Jeremiah is an example in the OT... said to have been known by God from the womb. Paul was another one... "a chosen vessel to me to bear my name to the nations as well as to kings and the sons of Israel." (Acts 9:15)

I guess God doesn't choose more people for "special treatment" because it interferes with their freedom of choice... but once in a while, perhaps it's necessary to "kick things off", as with Paul spreading the message of Christ so effectively to the nations.

Besides which, being one of God's few REAL "chosen", like Paul... isn't exactly a license to an easy life, is it? Jeremiah's life was in danger several times, and Paul was stoned and many times in danger of his life.


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03-14-2011 04:45 PM
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ablebodiedman
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Post: #39
RE: Divine Intervention In The Fall Of Jerusalem

Interpretum Wrote:
OK, so let me ask you...



(1) Why does God seem to judge more harshly, those nations (i.e. Japan) that are closer to techtonic fault lines?

Quote:
Think you should wait until the judgement is over before you make that conclusion.

The scriptures say the judgement will go from nation to nation.

Just because a nation at the present time seems unscathed does not mean their turn will not come.



(2) How do we tell when a disaster is natural, and when it's an activity from the "four winds"?

Quote:
Is the earth or the sea or the trees being harmed in a big way?


(3) Are all disasters throughout history an act of God, or just these latest ones?

Quote:
Don't know however, Jehovah did say a time would come when he would rise up and pay attention to the things happening on the earth.

I am convinced that time has come.

Isaiah 33:10-13
Now I will rise up,” says Jehovah, “now I will exalt myself; now I will lift myself up. 11 YOU people conceive dried grass; YOU will give birth to stubble. YOUR own spirit, as a fire, will eat YOU up. 12 And peoples must become as the burnings of lime. As thorns cut away, they will be set ablaze even with fire. 13 Hear, YOU men who are far away, what I must do! And know, YOU who are nearby, my mightiness.




In Christ

abe


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03-14-2011 04:53 PM
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