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Will Jesus be coming to earth again?
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ablebodiedman
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Post: #46
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Seraphim Wrote:
So I don`t think the Kingdom is of heaven ruling somewhere else, but God kingdoms domain, which is anywhere his will is done.



Seraphim,

I disagree.

Both the evil slave and the faithful slave have Jesus Christ as their
master. They are the slaves left in charge of his kingdom domain while he is away.

Matthew 24:48-51
“But if ever that evil slave should say in his heart, ‘My master is delaying,’ 49 and should start to beat his fellow slaves and should eat and drink with the confirmed drunkards, 50 the master of that slave will come on a day that he does not expect and in an hour that he does not know, 51 and will punish him with the greatest severity and will assign him his part with the hypocrites. There is where [his] weeping and the gnashing of [his] teeth will be.


If the evils slaves are eating and drinking with drunkards while beating their fellow slaves is it God's will?

No its not!

Yet it is still Jesus Christs Kingdom!

Your statement above does not fit with the realities explained in the bible.

When Jesus Christ returns to inspect his kingdom he will find people in that same "Gods kingdom domain" who are NOT doing Gods will:

Matthew 13:39-42
The harvest is a conclusion of a system of things, and the reapers are angels. 40 Therefore, just as the weeds are collected and burned with fire, so it will be in the conclusion of the system of things. 41 The Son of man will send forth his angels, and they will collect out from his kingdom all things that cause stumbling and persons who are doing lawlessness, 42 and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where [their] weeping and the gnashing of [their] teeth will be.



Let him that has ears listen.



In Christ

abe


the spiritual man examines all things

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06-07-2011 03:43 PM
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BruisedReed
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Post: #47
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Hi there Brian:hibye: ... interesting thoughts as usual ...:thinking:

When I read them I couldn't help but think right away of the familair expression ...

... Home is where the heart is ...

My 'radical' thought is that our 'home' will be BOTH of a heavenly and earthly nature ... based on Paul's words at 1 Corinthians 15:44 ...

44 It is sown a physical body, it is raised up a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual one.


We are now so limited in our thinking ... and for the future way of things some things we may be able to glean ... but IMHO a lot of it is only something we can 'speculate' on to some degree and not be rigid in as we just cannot know as of yet ... hence why I try not to say something is or isn't when it come to future things (and even things of the past since history does not always get things right ;) )

Jesus told his apostles ...

John 14:3 ...

3 Also, if I go my way and prepare a place for YOU, I am coming again and will receive YOU home to myself, that where I am YOU also may be. 

So if our Lord be in heaven or on earth at any time he wants he can take us with him cannot he not if we have the ability to have a 'spirit body or physical' one? Who can say if this will be so ... for with our God and his Son NOTHING is IMPOSSIBLE is it?

The scriptures seem to make clear that we humans were MADE for our earthly home ... a permanent residence in which to live ... but that doesn't negate the thought that we can't 'VISIT' the 'heavenly' realm from time to time does it in our 'spirit' bodies?

All this is of course just THOUGHTS ... so please don't think that I am 'teaching' or 'preaching' this idea as 'fact' in any way ... :love::blush::blush:

Luv ME :sheepy: :bouncyhearts:


http://bruisedreednotbroke.blogspot.com
06-07-2011 03:50 PM
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e-magine
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Post: #48
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

HI BR!
I am of the same mind. Are we spiritual beings in a physical body, or physical beings with a spiritual longing? I believe the first. The resurected Jesus showed what is posible for us.
The scripture you quoted, Jn 14:3.:
...Most Greek texts translate it as "gather you to myself", not home to myself. The later being a product of the inaccurate understanding of what Heaven is, and that Heaven is our ultimate "home".
Jesus will be with us, and we will be with Jesus, which means we will also be with each other. Think outside the 3 dimensional box and it makes total sense! It's beautiful!


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Henry Ward Beecher-1872 Preacher of Plymouth Church, Brooklyn, in his home later bought by C.H. Russell.
He is looking at the Brooklyn Bridge,,,, is it the way into, or, out of Brooklyn for you?
06-07-2011 04:51 PM
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isomam
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Post: #49
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

ablebodiedman Wrote:
Matthew 13:39-42

The harvest is a conclusion of a system of things, and the reapers are angels.


and, you know what, abe?

i am going to invite you to spend some time pondering just what system of things (?) jesus might have been referencing.

i know what you presently think. ... can you allow yourself to think outside that box for a few minutes?


Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners. Of these I am foremost.--1 Timothy 1:15.

Above all things, have INTENSE Love for one another.--1 Peter 4:8.

Sanctify the Christ as Lord in your hearts. ... Hold a good conscience.--1 Peter 3:15, 16.

TRUTH IS SIMPLE.
06-07-2011 05:28 PM
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Seraphim
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Post: #50
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Interesting thoughts form everyone.

A thought that occurs to me is regarding Adam in the garden of Eden. According to the account Adam was in a garden where as the rest of the earth was a wilderness. It was like an incubator or a guarded, protected place. Perhaps the earth and by extension the universe is but an incubator. This might symbolise our place and where we are going. The universe is Eden but its not permanent its a stating place. The Jewish temple seems to have been based on the garden of Eden. That was the root and starting place for the root and starting holy nation. Never supposed to be permanent because of those outside like the gentiles. The tree of life , (mercy seat) and the knowledge of good and bad is replaced by the ark of the covenant with the ten commandants ,(knowledge of good and bad) kept inside. That itself was replaced by Jesus being the tree of life and the law replaced by the spirit and its fruits. Note that both the tree and the ark are at the centre of the garden and temple respectively. Of course a jar of manner, or bread from heaven was also kept in the ark. Fruit was the first manner in Eden and manner was in the ark and that was replaced by Christ body which we eat in the bread and wine. So perhaps Eden and then the temple and then the earth itself may not be permanent. These things are always replaced.

Not the following verse that shows the temple was painted to look like a garden. Much more than this was done also.

Eze 41:20 from the ground unto above the door were cherubim and palm-trees made: thus was the wall of the temple.

Food for thought if one forgives me the pun.

06-07-2011 05:30 PM
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e-magine
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Post: #51
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Hi S!
I quickly read your post without my glasses and thought you said, a jar of manure was in the ark! ha ha!
...I can see that the Temple was modeled after the Garden! Aw-some!
Everything is in a state of recycling.
, the Earth, the Universe, only GOD is constant. The Earth will be our home for a long time. After awhile, we will move about! Just like Adam and Eve were destined to move beyond the garden!


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Henry Ward Beecher-1872 Preacher of Plymouth Church, Brooklyn, in his home later bought by C.H. Russell.
He is looking at the Brooklyn Bridge,,,, is it the way into, or, out of Brooklyn for you?
06-07-2011 06:15 PM
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Seraphim
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Post: #52
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

LOL I quickly read your post and though I had misspelled it LOL. I wish I had your glasses. :)

06-07-2011 06:24 PM
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gogh
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Post: #53
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Re: "...a jar of manure..."

...it's not "manner" either!...Unless one finds it difficult not to replace an "a" sound with a "er" sound....( a British thang (enunciation problem, possibly?...grin)

:coffeeread::whistle::drinking:


"......."This is my Son, whom I have chosen. Keep listening to him!" Luke 9:35
06-07-2011 06:45 PM
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Seraphim
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Post: #54
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Just lack of spelling ability on my part. If you want a proper cup of tea though im your man.

06-07-2011 06:48 PM
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gogh
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Post: #55
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

re: "...want a proper cup..."

..somehow I did not hear you pronounce the "er" sound in the word "proper".

I think I heard and "ah" sound...correct me if I'm wrong.

grin.

music interlude:

Back to the Garden by James Taylor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vr-6nUShh4o

:coffeeread:


"......."This is my Son, whom I have chosen. Keep listening to him!" Luke 9:35
06-07-2011 06:53 PM
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Measurer
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Post: #56
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

e-magine Wrote:
HI BR!
I am of the same mind. Are we spiritual beings in a physical body, or physical beings with a spiritual longing? I believe the first.


Hi e-magine and Sis BR,

Are we not both?

Physical beings with a spiritual longing UNTIL we are born again (or regenerated), when we become spiritual beings in physical bodies.

John3:3-7
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.


Your Christian brother,
Measurer. :hibye:

06-08-2011 04:09 AM
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COMankind
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Post: #57
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Hi Measurer, not sure we've met? Good to hear a new perspective.

Measurer Wrote:
Physical beings with a spiritual longing UNTIL we are born again (or regenerated), when we become spiritual beings in physical bodies.


This is a tangent, but one a recently attended a CoC class on (yes, its true, I did it out of sheer curiosity) - The next week I sat down with the professor, a man with two masters and a full comprehension of Greek and Hebrew - to discuss what he presented (which is close to what Measurer just stated) Mind you, this gentleman was incredibly humble considering his knowledge base.

We discussed 1 Cor 15 at length, which was at the core of his presentation.

it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being"; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. The first man was of the dust of the earth, the second man from heaven. As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth; and as is the man from heaven, so also are those who are of heaven. And just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly man, so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven. - 1 cor 15:44-49

Another piece was the physical resurrection of Jesus. That his tomb was empty (which was a major component) and when he returned to his apostles, they could somewhat recognize him.

Everything seemed to hinge on one thing though, that when the Bible teaches that "death is no more" that this refers to death as we know it. That this means we will be supplied with immortal physical bodies in a heaven on earth.

However:
- The bible teaches there are spirit creatures and there are fleshly. No combos. (1 cor 15:50)
- Jesus did a lot of things that were done for his disciples' benefit, like miracles, the transfiguration and hearing the voice of God. Seeing him after he died would have been the ultimate gesture of love and shepherding. Otherwise the apostles wouldn't have realized what happened. (acts 1:3)
- Jesus wasn't really physically himself post-death. Thomas needed to be convinced. He appeared magically in rooms. etc.
- Jesus didn't stick around in physical form. He went somewhere. Earth was not his destination.

"When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.” - 1 cor 15:54 - The professor taught an assumption that death would be swallowed up once for all mankind. But to me, verses like this imply that death is swallowed up per person, as a result of being 'transformed'

When I personally hear the term "born again" I think of a chick being born from an egg. First, the egg is laid. Second, the chick hatches into the form it was intended to be. We can break out of our physical shells and move on.


philia, COMankind

"The tent of God is with mankind" - Rev 21:3

06-08-2011 06:21 AM
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Measurer
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Post: #58
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Greetings to you COMankind.

Good to meet ya! I’ve been around the Café for a while but only sign in from time to time.

You said,

“The professor taught an assumption that death would be swallowed up once for all mankind. But to me, verses like this imply that death is swallowed up per person, as a result of being 'transformed'.”

I completely agree with you.

I believe that our Father draws us, individually, to Jesus Christ and then daily strengthens our faith, belief and trust in him. Each individual is in union with Christ and receiving the Holy Spirit. Yes, death has been ‘swallowed up’ although there is still an ongoing battle with the indwelling sin. However, the Holy Spirit within us fights this battle but we have to always be ready to respond to its promptings.

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

As regards the ‘type’ of body, 1 Thess 4:17 tells us, “….so shall we ever be with the Lord.” This being the case, whatever ‘type’ of body our Lord Jesus Christ has, ours must be the same.

1 John 3:2 says, "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is."

Besides, if we are in union with Christ and part of his body, we must be like him!

Just my penny’s worth.

Measurer. :hibye:

06-08-2011 08:16 AM
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ablebodiedman
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Post: #59
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Here is a physical/spiritual scripture to think about:


1 Corinthians 2:11-16
For who among men knows the things of a man except the spirit of man that is in him? So, too, no one has come to know the things of God, except the spirit of God. 12 Now we received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is from God, that we might know the things that have been kindly given us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not with words taught by human wisdom, but with those taught by [the] spirit, as we combine spiritual [matters] with spiritual [words].
14 But a physical man does not receive the things of the spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot get to know [them], because they are examined spiritually. 15 However, the spiritual man examines indeed all things, but he himself is not examined by any man. 16 For “who has come to know the mind of Jehovah, that he may instruct him?” But we do have the mind of Christ.




In Christ

abe


the spiritual man examines all things

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06-08-2011 12:13 PM
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e-magine
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Post: #60
RE: Will Jesus be coming to earth again?

Measurer Wrote:

e-magine Wrote:
HI BR!
I am of the same mind. Are we spiritual beings in a physical body, or physical beings with a spiritual longing? I believe the first.


Hi e-magine and Sis BR,

Are we not both?

Physical beings with a spiritual longing UNTIL we are born again (or regenerated), when we become spiritual beings in physical bodies.

Your Christian brother,
Measurer. :hibye:


Hi Measurer!
..In the ultimate connotation of "spiritual", I agree with you, we will be spiritual beings with physical bodies. But I was thinking that even before being "born again", we still have a spiritual nature embedded into our physical nature. How else could Adam have been physical, yet be in God's image? Other physical living creatures were not in His image. Our physical natures may have been subdued by our alienation from God, but the seed is still there to be germinated.
The scripture abe posted seems to allude to this. What do you and COM, and others, think?


avatar:
Henry Ward Beecher-1872 Preacher of Plymouth Church, Brooklyn, in his home later bought by C.H. Russell.
He is looking at the Brooklyn Bridge,,,, is it the way into, or, out of Brooklyn for you?
06-08-2011 01:04 PM
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