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Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!
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Interpretum
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Post: #16
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

Hi BR

Yes! I think I agree :)

Also, a related idea occurred to me as I read your post. This is also the similar to how we see the idea of CONQUERING...

"To the one that conquers I will grant to sit down with me on my throne..."

I suppose we are used to thinking of conquest as a violent act. However, Jesus conquered the world with barely a raised voice!

I guess this is why many translations use the word OVERCOMES here. It has a slightly more peaceful connotation than "conquers"

In other words, when a Christian "conquers" the world, they get to "rule as kings"... but both are in reference to the sinful, fallen world and the mortal flesh and blood!


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07-22-2011 10:02 PM
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Post: #17
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

Dear Interpertum and BB.

First BB adding to the good points you made about ruling the earth.
I found the wording interesting in Gen 1:26 "...let them rule/reign over ..." He created us to be a blessing for the earth to care for it and all life, I believe that's what it will mean to reign in life on earth in the Kingdom of God.

Now Interpertum I want to say you have mentioned something very special and important. I totally agree the conquer as mentioned in the bible for christians has nothing to do with overcoming other people!
I was studying on this a few years ago and I recall finding a very interesting connection with this theme of overcoming/conquering.
We know there are a few places in the bible when someone would get a new name when they would have a living faith. Look at this account with Jacob in Gen 32:28
' He said, "Your name shall no longer be Jacob, but Israel ; for you have striven with God and with men and have prevailed."
The word for prevailed also means to overcome! This event is very special because it's when his name is changed to Israel. Why did he get his name changed? Well as far as I can see he showed he REALLY believed that the blessing of God was real and worth having, so with all his might he struggled to gain that blessing but this phyical struggle is also a symbol for the struggle each person has in thier heart again doubt, do we believe in God's promises or do we doubt them. So then to become part of Israel and have our names changed also we need to overcome, prevail, conquer doubt, we need to have faith like Christ did.

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07-23-2011 03:23 AM
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BruisedReed
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Post: #18
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

I think that this scripture may also go along with the above comments showing exactly what this 'conquering' or 'overcoming' IS (and perhaps looking at ANOTHER word to describe this 'conquering' as well) ... and the BLESSING that comes to us for doing so! :present:

1John 5:4 ...

(NWT) because everything that has been born from God conquers the world. And this is the conquest that has conquered the world, our faith.

(BBE) Anything which comes from God is able to overcome the world: and the power by which we have overcome the world is our faith.

(LITV) Because everything having been born of God overcomes the world, and this is the victory overcoming the world, our faith.


The Greek word for 'overcomes/conquers' is ...

G3528 νικάω
nikaō nik-ah'-o

From G3529; to subdue (literally or figuratively): - conquer, overcome, prevail, get the victory.[/b]

G3529 νίκη
nikē nee'-kay

Apparently a primary word; conquest (abstractly), that is, (figuratively) [b]the means of success: - victory.


So, what is our 'MEANS' of our 'success or victory' ...?

our FAITH

and what is the BLESSING ...?

2 Tim. 4:7,8 7 ...

I have fought the fine fight, I have run the course to the finish, I have observed the faith. 8 From this time on there is reserved for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, will give me as a reward in that day, yet not only to me, but also to all those who have loved his manifestation.

James 1:12 ...

Happy is the man that keeps on enduring trial, because on becoming approved he will receive the crown of life, which Jehovah promised to those who continue loving him.

Yes, this 'crown' is not a 'literal crown' as we might see on a king or queen, but rather symbolic of something VERY SPECICAL ... at least that is how I view it ...

G4735 στέφανος
stephanos stef'-an-os


From an apparently primary “stepho” (to twine or wreathe); a chaplet (as a badge of royalty, a prize in the public games or a symbol of honor generally; but more conspicuous and elaborate than the simple fillet, G1238), literally or figuratively: - crown.


Yes, no longer will we be sinful wicked creatures, but rather we will be 'reborn' and be 'pure and clean, approved and acceptable' in the truest sense to our God and Lord!!

1 Pet. 5:4 ...

And when the chief shepherd has been made manifest, YOU will receive the unfadable crown of glory.


The Greek word for 'glory' is ...

G1391 δόξα
doxa dox'-ah

From the base of G1380; glory (as very apparent), in a wide application (literally or figuratively, objectively or subjectively): - dignity, glory (-ious), honour, praise, worship.


And to me just because we receive 'crowns' ... doesn't mean we will sit on 'thrones' ... for the 'crowns' we receive are of a different nature are they not?

However, we will 'rule' ... but this 'ruling' is again not as we have come to see it observed throughout the millenias of human history ...

But it will be done in a life peace and love and harmony with all living things all around us!

Perhaps a clue to this is in the fact that our heavenly Father is AWARE OF even a tiny SPARROW when it falls to the ground is observed and felt by our Father in the heavens above ... then is this not the KIND OF RULE that we will ALSO be imitating ... showing the CARING NATURE for ALL THINGS 'great and small' ...??!!

Is this not the KIND of KINGDOM (or REALM) our 'earth' ... that we would want to live in? Is this not the kind of place too that the literal heavenly home of the spirit creatures dwell in yearn for and will live in as we to?

So may it be ... and SOON!!

Anyway, rambled on long enough ... :blush:

I'll let someone else add their thoughts and feelings ...

Luv as always BR :happyheart:


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07-23-2011 10:12 AM
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Yannis
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Post: #19
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

The Thrones are a class of celestial beings, like angels, archangels, seraphim and cherubs. They are the carriers of the throne of God, hence the name.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.
07-23-2011 02:48 PM
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BruisedReed
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Post: #20
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

Hi br. Yannis ...

Could explain expand on that and with scripture?

I realize that you might be referring to Col. 1:16 perhaps where one 'might' conclude that it isn't a 'throne' either literal or physical but rather what the throne might represent ...

(ASV) for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;

(BBE) For by him all things were made, in heaven and on earth, things seen and things unseen, authorities, lords, rulers, and powers; all things were made by him and for him;

(GNB) For through him God created everything in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen things, including spiritual powers, lords, rulers, and authorities. God created the whole universe through him and for him.

(GW) He created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible. Whether they are kings or lords, rulers or powers- everything has been created through him and for him.


Looking forward to your thoughts ...

BR :happyheart:


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07-23-2011 04:16 PM
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Post: #21
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

I wish the smiles were working right now!:hug:

I just want to say I so agree and understand what you are saying. There are more vs's that we could add that together clearly paint this beautiful picture of life on earth in God's kingdom!.

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07-23-2011 07:12 PM
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Yannis
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Post: #22
RE: Rethinking Thrones How Many and Who Sits on Them!

BruisedReed Wrote:
Hi br. Yannis ...

Could explain expand on that and with scripture?


Some understand civil magistrates among men, and the various degrees and orders of them. By "thrones" they think kings, or monarchs, are meant, who sit on thrones; and by "dominions", little petty kings, or lords, dukes, and earls; and by "principalities", governors of provinces and cities; and by "powers", interior magistrates; and indeed, political governors are sometimes called dominions, dignities, principalities, and powers; and there are different orders of them, the king as supreme, and governors under him.

But since these seem rather to be said of the invisible things in heaven, and to be an explanation of them, spirit creatures may rather be thought to be intended.


Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.
07-23-2011 10:25 PM
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